Bean

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=18...56014&q=peugeot In case you guys haven't seen it yet - google has a video specific search now... http://video.google.com Enjoy! Rabin

The only parts that worry me are bearing shells, timing chain, timing chain tensioner - stuff that would be really hard to make or find comparible replacements. (They may not even be that hard to replace....) Gaskets can be made quite easily, seals can be ordered by dimension, and if necessary machining the outside dimension to fit a different seal isn't that hard to do. Pistons, rods, valves, cams etc etc can all be made fairly reasonably if you don't go all out hardcore race ready stuff. I'm going to spend considerable effort finding and using other parts from other engine so that I can basically re-do the engine with readily available parts - and hopefully gain significant power potential to boot. If that fails - then an engine swap will definitley be the way I go. For all the work necessary to fit an engine - I'd make sure it was a SWEET set up much like Metako's - not sure I'd stay with a turbo 4 though. A nice V6 or even a lightweight V8 would make for a very sweet car. (Think LS6 6-speed... Half the fun for me is going to be the build process - the "family" car should suffice for transportation needs - the Pugs are just going to the ways that I vent my automotive engineer side that I always wanted to be!

That was my first car. Stuffed a 604 V6 4-sp into my 76 504 SL auto sedan when I was 17. It was a DAMN fine car, but she passed away from rust. I still have the engine and tranny in my garage (17 years later!) I now have a 76 504 SL sedan with an 81 505 SR euro spec XN1 engine and 5-sp tranny. It runs beautifully. I also have an 83 504 Wagon with no motor. Now the dilema - In my garage I have all the goodies to swap one of the cars to a Weber equipped V6 with Renault exhaust manifolds, 5-sp tranny, and 505 Turbo suspension - so I have to decide which car gets which. A sleeper V6 504 wagon would be an awesome summer family car - and that's the direction I'm leaning since the 505 Turbo is going to be my slalom monster. Just need to figure out the pro's and cons of each - but I'm leaning to the V6 wagon since the sedan is such a sweet runner with the XN1 - it just needs a nice Weber 38 DGV to wake it up a bit more... First project to get running well though is the 505 Turbo. Once that's well on it's way as the summer daily driver - then I get to start the restorations of the classic cars. The 2 504's and the 505 Turbo are the only pugs I intend on keeping... forever...

Very nicely done Metako! Looks like it belongs there... It's nice to know we have other re-engine options for our beloved old cars. A SR20 DET is definitely a sweet engine with tremednous potential. Keep us posted if you can let us know any performance statistics - I've very curious how it compares to the stock 505 Turbo that we got in North America... Rabin

Looks like the AFM itself is a reason to upgrade the ECU! My initial reason was because I see the vane style AFM as a choke point - but now we know they're flakey too... Hopefully once some of us get to experiment with alternative engine management - I have a feeling that we'll really wake these cars up and see some of the potential they are capable of. 300 HP/ 300 ft-lbs should be a cake walk for these motors. 400 HP shouldn't be out of reach either... As a side note - a buddy of mine that is going to help be do the swap ECU swap onto my car took a look at the N9TE head and said the Dodge guys would KILL to have a head that looked like ours. I'm tempted to drop it off at the machinist that ported and polished his 2.5L Turbo Dodge head just to see what it flows stock out of the box. The TD limitation on the stock head is about 300 HP - so if the Pug flows more than that we should be good to 350+... Now to see how much he'd charge just to flow the head... Rabin

Yep - re-drilling the hubs to 5x120, and custom spacers to make sure the 17x8.5's fit on the back, and the 7.5x16's fit on the front. (5 series has the correct offset as long as they are 7" wide wheels. Over that width and I think there'll me some clearance issues. This will be my first mod done to my car this spring - so stay tuned! Rabin

Right now - the vague plan in my head says to locate the tank on the passenger side so that I can use the existing fuel tank door and such - plus it's opposite the driver. I'd likely have to place the battery on the driver side because of the tank - and the plan for the exhaust is to run right out the middle. Initially I wanted the 3" exhaust to come right out the rear valence panel, and through the bumper - but I might do a 3" mandrel bend and have it point straight down - something that stays out of sight. With it pointing down it will also be quieter - since the sound has to reflect off the ground first. The Lancia Delta Intergrale I drove had the exhaust like that and I really liked it - sounded awesome as well. Rabin

I guess the thing to test is that all 4 AFM's have the same reading at max flap angle - one would assume that they should read identically at a given apeture - so I'd also test with holding the flap open with various objects to see if the AFM gives the same readings... This is a great topic so I'm vaery curious to find out what the results are! Rabin...

I think the Finnish guys are really setting the bar high for the restification of these monsters, so I'm going to get my butt in gear so that I can join the rest of the North American guys in their build ups. I hate being "all talk" at the moment - but with marriage comes comprimises. Fortunately this comprimises mean being virtually debt free fairly soon - so the chance to spend some decent cash on this project is just around the corner. I'm leaning heavily towards buying my own Tig machine so that I can make a lot of the modifications necessary to build a sweet car. As for your exhaust - tig welded stainless header construction is pretty darn cool. I really enjoy seeing the effort and quality work you guys are putting into these old beasts. I've often thought about finding an equal length shorty stainless steel header from at V8 that had similar primary pipe spacing - then weld on Peugeot specific flanges, and the specific turbo flange. The trick will be to find a header that would work with minimal work. I too would like to run an external wategate set up - so construction of a header is on my list as well - but definitely after I get the alternate FI set up and programmed. (forum was quiet for a while there - I was going through withdrawl!) Rabin

I think I may have a spare AFM in the garage I can check out. Any chance you can post the pin out diagram? I can find it for myself - but if you want others to check as well it might be handy for them to have. (Or is it labelled on the connector?) It makes sense that it *should* be linear - but I'm guessing after all these years there may be some dead spots or "dips" in the resistance readings. It'll be good to hear other results - but I'd guess that as long as there's a trend of linear progression they should still work. Rabin

I don't think I've ever weighed the 505 Turbo - but I did find out that at buddy of mine has access to some corner weight scales from his circle track race club... I'll definitely be make use of that when I start relocating stuff like the battery and fuel tank. I weighed my 504 V6, and the fr/rr ratio was pretty damn good at 53/47 - that was with a battery relocated to the rear right corner and no driver. Stock ratings had the car at 51/49. When I relocated the battery to my truck - I'm also thinking that the battery box should be recessed into the trunk floor as well so that the weight it not only moved back - but down as well. Depending on the weight on each wheel - I could size the battery accordingly. (I'm currently running a very slim Honda style battery in the front. Saves some decent weight.) Rabin

Those old KKK's are known for nasty turbo lag - but once they spooled they provide good boost. Getting a different exhaust housing might help with that especially since your displacement is only 2.2L. You do have an awesome header built - so it'll definitely help the old girl spool up. Have you thought about providing enough fuel - any ideas for feeding the motor? I'm always curious to see how guys are going to do it. I personally am going to try modifying an exisiting ECU from another 2.2L turbo 4 cylinder that has been "hacked" so that it's pretty much fully programmable. Should be fun - and if all goes well I can start posting my progress this spring! Rabin

Welcome to the site! Very nice work on the exhaust manifold. I also checked out some of the rest of the pictures on your site and you've done a heck of a lot of work on that car. Looks great, and with that turbo it should go even better... Definitely big - any idea of the model? I'm curious what kind of flow ratings it has - or do you know the motor it came from? Rabin

For clarification - I'm advocating running wires from the battery back to the engine as a priority. Running additional grounds to the trunk definitely won't hurt - but the only advantage I could see is providing a cleaner path for the rear lights and stuff. Up front you DEFINTELY want to run grounding cables from the block to the body. Key is to just provide a dedicated cable to all large sources of electrical draw. Again - this is just "recommended" as it would likely run fine just the way it is, but if you want to be absolutely sure and really eliminate some portential problems, then it might be worth considering. I've never done any testing or anything - but I know that there's a significant upgrade to going to a 4-wire O2 sensor - and it has 2 grounds. 1 is for the powered heater, and the other is for the sensor itself. They don't share the ground wire so the signal is cleaner. Just my $0.02

I like the style of the wheels, but I think the scale might be off in your picture - they're a bit too big. If you end up lowering the car that low - those big wheels are going to interfere with the fenders on turns and such - so I'd definitley mount the wheels first - then see how much lowering it can take and still function. Looks like a great plan though! Rabin

According to the electrical shop I had my car when I first relocated a battery (almost 20 years ago!) and presently confirmed by stereo installers), the best way to relocate a battery was to run both cables from the trunk - to the engine for ground and to the + on the starter. (master kill switch was also recommended inline). The reason they gave was that grounding to the chassis was considered "dirty" in that it wasn't as effective in completing the electrical circuit. (I had the same thinking as V-M - chassis grounded at both points should be good enough.) I now can see how a dedicated cable to the block from the negative post to the block is better than going through the chassis for giving a cleaner ground, and it kind of makes sense with all these "grounding kits" being sold now. People are seeing noticable improvements by using better grounds, and making sure that the ground circuit is done mostly with cable instead of relying on the chassis alone. (Allows the sensors to work better my providing a better signal because it has a better ground) If it works for you as is great - I just know what I've seen, and the improvements I've witnessed. (It sounds stupid - but I've found improvements by doing it so I've changed my mind on it...) Rabin

And that's a huge ass battery too... I wonder if they tossed the altenator and ran a total loss electrical system... I also agree on the lower the better (tank location) for handling. In my case I'm thinking the passenger rear side so that the filler can go straight down into it. (Plus it's opposite the driver) The ones I've seen have a 1.5" lip that sits on the trunk floor - so you cut the hole in the trunk floor and the tank drops down into the hole and you secure it with the lip. I know there's a guy in town that is building alloy tanks, and has built one for a buddy - now I just need to see if he can build a 60L or so tank. If it is something I can get built - then I'd look at setting up a tank with a "reserve" tank of say 10L that I could keep filled with race gas. Flick a switch and have ready access to fuel that would support say a different map with higher peak boost. That'd be a sweet mod for a daily driver... Rabin

I've been thinking a lot about the tank options, and it occured to me that if getting the tank shipped here from Finland proves too much of a hassle (which I think it would!), then another option would be to put in a racing fuel cell. (One with a decent size so I still have some range.) I'll have to price out options and stuff - but it might be a decent option that allows me to place it where it will be most effective - and still be able to use the passenger side fuel door. Between that and relocating the battery - the car should have excellent balance. I wonder if they make cells that are divided. Have the option to run race gas on one side and unleaded on the other. Then you could have the high boost setting configured for C16 and be able to run accordingly... Thoughts? Comments? Rabin

LOL! I guess this isn't the place to get heck for buying another car - so congrats! Car looks decent from the pictures and I'm curious how that engine would run with the exhaust manifold mods and the mitsu turbo... One thing that I noticed was the ground cable looks like it might run from the battery to the car body at the back. If this is the case - that's a big no-no. You should run both cables to the front for proper power supply and ground. (I ran it like that in my V6 504 and had no end of issues till I ran the cables up front. You propably know this already but I thought I'd mention it anyway...) I'd recommend at least 4 ga fine strand welding wire, but I like to use 1 ga wire. I also ground to rear chassis as well, but the main wire runs up to the engine compartment. I usually put a junction block up front somewhere so the car can be boosted from either the front or the back... If you get it running - let us know what you're impressions are! Rabin

That's kinda my thoughts as well. Racing engineers would KILL to be able to lower the cg of the tank 40 cm to somewhere around the center of the wheels... Only bad thing about this mod is moving the mass of the tank farther to the rear of the car - increasing the polar moment of inertia. (Best to keep the mass low and close to the center of the car.) I believe it was Gordon Murray who said you can tell a car is well engineered if the calipers "face" the inside when viewed from the side. (Sadly ours don't - they're both on the rear side of the wheel. Rear caliper should be on the "front" side...) Hopefully if the costs are reasonable - then I'd be all over all the effort to install the euro tank. (Can't argue with a free tank! Thanks for the offer V-M!) Between the lower CG and the increased trunck size - it's something to pursue... Rabin

Some detailed pics would be most appreciated! As for shipping - sending it by sea would likely be the cheapest - but I'd have NO idea with respect to the costs involved. Sending it via ship would likely be quite economical - and I'd likely get it in spring which would be perfect. As for the intank pump - I'd hope that they used the same pump in the NA spec trunk tank. If not - it shouldn't be as necessary. My plan is to use a Walbro 255 pump in my build up, but I may use the CIS pump instead since it can provide fuel flow and pressure for some serious power as well. (Peter Farrell used a Peugeot CIS pump on his first high output Mazda RX7 build up - he was the guy that raced the 505 in SCCA racing in the 80's that then went on to build monster Mazda RX7's) US cars used the "primer" tank pump to make sure the main pump always had fuel. The main pump can work without the in tank primer pump - but it has to work much harder and is supposed to cause the main pump failure eventually. Do the Euro cars have the same system - or is the tank pump the main pump? If you can provide detailed pics - it will let me see what would be involved with the retro fit. If it's possible - I'd be interested in everything needed to make it look "factory" - so the tank, driver side door assembly (including surrounding panel), tube to tank, pretty much anything that could be cut out and included... I'm guessing the shipping cost itself won't be the issue - but getting the parts together, packaging it, and sending it off are going to be what should cost the most. If this cost can be estimated - and if you can provide any shipping possibilities for sending it regular post via sea mail, then this is a mod I'd seriously consider doing... (Body mods, tank mounting fabrication, and custom exhaust piping are all being done anyway - under trunk tank would just change some of my plans... Fabrication is going to be one of the joys of this long term project) Thanks for checking into this guys! BTW - any other North American's think this is cool - or I'm I the only one crazy enough to consider this?

Man you guys are building some SWEET 505 Turbo's!! Juha - you car is VERY nice indeed. Us North American enthusiasts need to step it up a notch so we can be in the same league - but seeing all of your fine examples of how it should be done is doing a real nice job of motivating me to get my car into proper shape. As an aside - any idea's on if it would be possible to retrofit the Euro plastic 70L tank into a car here in Canada? I'd love to recoup all that trunk space, as well as get some added touring capacity to the tank. Having a corrosion resistant tank would also help with storing the cars over the winter. I'd be interested in seeing how much all that would cost to ship to Canada - so if there are any takers please let me know! Rabin

That's a very nice car indeed! I love the: - Gas tank under the trunk - must have a HUGE trunk without the tank in there. (I'd love to put a euro tank mine and lose the trunk tank...) - The "biode" headlights - they have the extra high beam bulb in them like my old euro 504 headlights. I'd love to get a set of those for my car as well - or modify my existing euro lights with the extra bits. (I have 100W H3 bulbs for high beam in my 504 lights and they're AMAZING!) - rear tail lights on the euro cars - very tidy. The kit itself looks good on the car. Sadly, we never got anything like that here. But we do get snow here, there just isn't any yet...

I just checked out Yq397r's Car Domain site... Damn that's a nice diesel 505! You did an awesome job on it's restoration - and I really like the paint scheme. Different, but still very classy and it suits the car's body style very well. It's really nice to see that kind of detail and attention put into one of these old cars... I've been mulling the idea of a two tone paint scheme myself - very similar, except with a dark navy over silver... Still thinking, but I'd shave the marker lights and the trim as well - car looks much leaner without it. As for the wheels - hopefully I'll have an answer to the wheel issue this spring when I finish doing up the BMW wheel swap. It's looking promising - but I won't be happy till the car is rolling on the new wheels. Off topic - with regards to your bike. I had an 82 Kawasaki 1100 Spectre that had a very similar look to your Yamaha. One of the nicest upgrades I did to it was to knock the triple clamp down 2 inches (shocks come up 2" in the front ) dropping the front down and decreasing steering rake - which makes the bike much more responsive. I also replaced the handle bars with superbike bars - they essentially went straight across which gave it a super mean muscle bike look that was really comfortable to ride. That bike got sold when I got married - now I have an 82' GPz 750 to restore... Apparently I have an issue with 80's machines too! Rabin

I was wrong about the airing time - it was last night. Luckily I caught it on tape and watched it this morning. Awesome rally! It was easily the most exciting of the year. Heartbreaking for Skoda - man that sucked. It would have been a great underdog story... (Still was in a way I guess...) Sounds like the Focus... Focii? Will be a force next year, as well the privateer Chronos team with Loeb driving his old Xsare will be hard to beat... (It was kinda nice to see him make an error!) Definitley worth the effort to see it... Can't wait to see how next year unfolds now... Rabin