Bean

Sorry - I was confused at first by what you've read vs what you witnessed, but I got it now. I've never read about running larger rims with lower aspect ration on front - usually it's the same size or smaller rim with the low aspect ratio tire for that lower sidewall. Makes sense though if you think about it - the larger rim with low profile tire would give you a slightly longer contact patch... Since my car is going to be a daily driver with limited track time for fun - I'll likely not need that advantage... Rabin

I probably should have wrote that better - the issue isn't with the 18" wheels that cause the sucky handling, but the change to the suspension geometry on how the tire contacts the road. Ideally the tire's contact patch should rotate about it's center when you turn your steering wheel. Putting wider tires on with the wrong offset changes this and you end up with less than desireable handling traits. (car darts around, follows depressions in the road etc.) I have no problem with 18" wheels per se, but they need to be designed to fit the car for them to work properly. In the 505T's case - I know that I will likely have some issues with wider wheels, but I've minimized the effect as much as possible without redesigning the suspension. If the car handles like crap, then I'll redesign the geometry of the strut to hub and see if I can get the contact patch to rotate about itself. The limiting factor is definitely the strut to wheel clearance - so you're really limited to width. The closest wheel that I found was the 5 series wheels that had the desireable RWD offset (20mm), so I did the best I could with the info I found. Hopefully I found a decent balance - but I won't know for sure till I can run the car on the track... (May 13th is a track day - so failing the car show - I want it done for that!) Those pics are the reverse of what you've written... (RR is right rear, LF is Left Front...) They show having smaller front wheels, with larger rear wheels... Exactly what I've planned for my car. I've heard of playing around with different tire sizes to fine tune handling traits, but I've never seen larger front wheels. Rabin

Adapter VS hub re-drilling To me the difference is show VS go. I run my car quite hard in solo II, so running thick alloy adapters where all the wheel forces have to be transmitted through an adapter is unacceptable for my needs. I wanted to to have maximum strength, and I wanted to limit the force exerted on the bearings. (Running adapters basically gives more leverage to the forces incurred which isn't ideal.) For my needs I wanted to have as close an offset as possible so that I would limit the distance needed to mount the wheel so that I can just run a spacer of minimal thickness. I also chose the BMW pattern since there are some very high quality BBS stock wheels that can be bolted on, and the price of used compares with cheap aftermarket wheels. The wheels are also designed to be on a high HP RWD car - not engineering for a FWD car. Don't mean to put down what you've done - but for what I wanted - it just wasn't going to be suitable. I'd still like to hear how your car drives with smaller rims though - sounded like the handling with the 18's sucked... Rabin

I lucked out and scored my car club some HUGE publicity doing demonstrations of pavement slaloms outside the front doors of Regina's first major auto show. It's going to be small of course - but we should still get a lot of exposure. The show is April 21-23 - and this is the new goal for getting the wheel swap done and in place, since I want to be running the car in the demos that we'll be doing. All the parts come Mar 31st, so it'll be tight to get complete - but as long as there isn't any major design revision, then it should go togther nicely...

The BMW offset for the 5 series cars is +20mm and on a 7" wide BMW rim the backspacing is identitical to the OEM Peugeot 15" rim. I'm basing my conversion off the 89 525 - but from what I've read, you can pretty much swap E34 - E39 wheels - the just changed the mounting ring size - and they have ring adapters to use the large opening on the smaller hubs. (This ring I speak of is machined onto the bolt flange - the wheel sits on this machined ring to locate the wheels so that the wheel bolts can be used.) The trick is clearing the front strut on the 505T - and since I went to the 7.5" wheel, I suspect that I'll be needing a 5mm spacer to get optimal clearance, and to not upset the handling at all. The spacer is integral in my set up as the bolt flange is going to be used to locate the spacer, and the spacer is going to have the ring for the wheel to sit on - which is needed to keep strength at a peak. The rear is where I'm getting creative - there's a lot of space behind the tires on my car - so the 8.5" wheels I have only have a 13mm offset which means they will go a further inside the wheel well - the spacer is likely going to be fairly thin as well, but just to optimize wheel location, and to locate the wheels properly. (Guys that locate wheels with just the studs aren't really doing it properly - and your just asking for vibration issues to occur IMHO.) Like I've said - I've put a lot of time and effort into it, and if the theoretical pans out as I've planned - this should be a killer set up on the car. I should be able to run 245-17-40's on the back, and 225-45-16 up front - but again I'll be carefully weighing the pros and cons, and trying different size tires till I get the balance of OEM - but with a 50+% gain in traction....

OK - so Phase 1 is just ordering all the needed parts - but it's still exciting! I have two new Racing Dynamics RGP 16x7.5" wheels coming, and two 20 pc BMW stud kits. The plan is to do up two sets of hubs for the 505 Turbo (FR and RR). If all goes well - then I can offer the 5 bolt conversion hubs with custom spacers - but the spacers will have to be custom for each wheel application. (I'll need specific wheel spec's in order to have the spacers machined to proper thickness - But they will have to be BMW 5 series wheels) My wheel package consists of 17x8.5" rears, and 16x7.5" fronts - and once I've done all the measuring, and created the spacers for my application, I'll be able to extrapolate to other wheel dimensions to ensure a perfect fit. I've done a lot of research so far - and this should be a VERY strong set up. The studs are threaded directly into the hub - so although there is a custom spacer - the wheel is still directly bolted to the hub. The spacers are also designed to locate the wheels (as per BMW wheel design) so the studs just hold it tight - the wheel is located directly by the hub to retain strength. Hopefully this isn't a stupid expensive upgrade - but it will be limited to the use of BMW 5 series wheels since they have the closes offset, and a bigger bolt pattern that's still common. So if any of you are interested - let me know ahead of time, and as costs become more concrete I can update everyone on the kit cost. I'm just going to do a cost recovery set up - so my expenses are covered and that's it. Any deals I get from my buddy doing the machining are also being passed on. If all goes well - this shouldn't be more that $300 USD (With hub exchange) for the complete custom hubs, and custom machined spacers. ($75 per wheel) Comments are welcome... (cause if no one's interested then I won't bother any sort of production.) Rabin

I'm working on something for disks for either car - but first will be the non-abs... The guy that is machining the 5x120 pattern on the hubs for my car, and making the custom spacer to fit the wheels is going to look at what would be necessary to machine custom center hats that fit the hubs and mount to Wilwood racing disks. The replacement disks are cheap (~$30USD), are light, cross drilled, and readily available. Initially the plan was to do it so that I can run 12" rotors and a custom bracket to run 4 piston Wilwood calipers - but it wouldn't take much to do it up so that it'd just replace the stock rotors. Once we do the prototype's for everything (my car) - then I'll have an idea on how much it costs and I can see if it's worth doing for others. We just recently looked at doing them so that the disk is a floating disk - very trick sounding, but a cheap upgrade when machining them from scratch - extra cost will be the mounting pins/bolts - but again they are available as well. (Rigidly mounting alloy centers to iron disks cause warping in racing - likely not an issue for everyday driving, but it's a cheap upgrade - why not!) Spacer info: Spacer will locate itself on the bolt flange's out circle, and provide the locating ring for the BMW wheel, studs will just hold it all tight together. Depending on the costs - I might be able to provide complete units, or just the "hats" so that they could be built overseas and shipping would be cheap. Rabin

That looks great! Do you think you'd ever look at just putting in a hood scoop or a "power bulge" into the hood instead of altering the manifold? Once you go to a MAF ECU - the turbo could then be fed through a large NACA duct in the hood or something since it wouldn't have to be going through the VAF. It wouldn't be too stealthy - but it would get you the best air supply. Rabin

So is there no way to adhere it back together - say with windsheild urethane? I have NO idea what you're talking about WRT how it's put together, but if it's just two halves that need to be put together with some "shock absorbtion" then that black urethane would be pretty strong, and since it's rubber based - it would allow for some shock protection. Just an idea though - might be quite the process to get the urethane into the pulley. Rabin PS - If that's totally out of whack - post some pics of the pulley so we can see what's wrong. Rabin

I'm glad you guys kept the forum limited till the traffic warranted an expansion - but now that it's time to expand, it might make sense to still keep it fairly basic. Maybe just divided it up into RWD, and FWD? Or by series? (4, 5, and 6?) I think a separate performance forum would be great as well - but I wouldn't limit it to just 505 Turbo's. Since speed freaks are generally interested in all modification ideas - it would be a good place to bounce ideas off other like minded individuals. Plus a lot of modification ideas for our cars are fairly universal. Rabin

Well - the bellhousing question is what this whole idea is based on. So far though it looks promising. As for the 2.6L - It makes sense that they take what they had and improve upon it. I know that the bore between the XD3 and the 2.6 are the same - so it *could* be a stroked XD motor with a new head on it - but that's mostly wishful thinking on my part. If I could stuff a 2.6L CRDe into the 504 wagon - it'd make for a decently quick, efficient car that would be the perfect highway runner. Heck - even having access to a NEW XD3T would be a nice option for getting that 504 wagon back on the road. Hopefully it works out - it'd make a kick ass family car! Rabin

http://www.peugeot-505.com/component/optio...1/limitstart,0/ Was just cruising and found this through the links on this site... Unfortunately it looks like they're doing the 4x??? instead of the 5x120 I originally was told they did. There isn't any documentation - but it looks like it would be pretty straight forward. From what I can see on my dark monitor - the bolts for attaching the disk are replaced by wheel studs/bolts that attach the disk and come right through and become the wheel studs as well. Pretty simple - too bad I'm already commited to the 5x120! Later... Rabin

The 8-spoke steelies would be a no... The Gotti wheels look like the Politechnic wheels - so I'm guessing they'll be quite expensive. If they were decently priced then I'd go for them. Hopefully before April I'll have some answers on the BMW wheel conversion - if all goes well I may even be able to provide converted hubs and spacers on an exchange basis - I have an extra set of the old style hubs and the ABS style... Keep your fingers crossed! Rabin

Hey August - that does indeed look like the Volvo intercooler. I've checked out getting one out of the 240 Turbo as well as I understand that they were all the same between the turbo Volvo cars. They are supposed to be pretty decent - but a proper alloy FMIC cooler is supposed to be better - but it's hard to pass up for $100 or so that you can get them on e-bay for. Rabin

It was indeed a fun trip. Definitely a life changing trip for sure. As for pictures - I took about 20 rolls of 24! I couldn't afford a decent digital that would rival the picture quality of my Nikon FE2 - so I decided to just shoot 35mm instead of sacrificing quality and getting a less than desireable digital camera. If I get a chance to post them online I'll pass on the link. Rabin

Yep - I ride too - just not right now though... My first bike was a 1977 CB750 Super Sport - cam broke in half and while looking for a replacement I found all this crazy aftermarket performance stuff for it. (Period drag engine upgrades - big bore kit, hot cam, covers, elect ignition etc.). Before I could assemble it my buddy that sold me the bike offered me cash for every penny I had into the bike and all the bits. I was low and cash and took the money. I shoulda kept it! Second bike was an 82 Kawasaki Spectre 1100. Shaft drive crusier bike. I put superbike handle bars on it, almost straight across instead of the mini ape hangers, knocked the forks down 2" in the triple clamps, and redid air distribution lines for them as well. Replaced the exhaust can with a 24" glass pack that was supposed to be a temp measure - but it sounded so sweet I kept it on! Painted it black with brand new rubber on it. Bike was super fast and looked a lot like a V-Max - but looked and sounded meaner. Sold it when I got married. I now have an 82 Kawaski GPz 750 that's in parts in my garage. I don't really have the time to fix it, and my wife has given the OK to buy a bike this spring so I'll likely be going for a nice sport touring bike. It'll depend on cash - so if I gave up the 505 Turbo I could get a Ducati ST4 - but since that isn't going to happen I'll have to settle for an older but still capable bike. I'm thinking a nice FJ1200, or an older ZX-10 - something comfy enough for a 1000 mile road trip, but still STUPID fast... Rabin

Very nice indeed! I'd just be happy with half that power - so it shouldn't be that hard should it? Rabin

Hey guys, Just got back from India yesterday - trip was a blast! I even visited a race course in Chennai - saw some pretty cool machines. Since I'm always looking for all things Peugeot I came across a couple tidbits that I'm working on getting more info on - if it pans out I may have a complete source of parts for the XD3's and maybe a bolt in replacement - a 2.6L common rail diesel to be exact! Turns out a company in India (Mahindra) has an engine deal with Peugeot and has used and is using what seems to be the XD3 in one of their SUV's (Bolero). Once I confirm it's the exact motor then I can look at sourcing parts and even complete motors. The most exciting possibility though is that they recently came out with a new model that uses a 2.6L Turbo diesel common rail motor - my hope is that they used the same bellhousing as the XD3 (Hoping of course it's the same pattern as the Peugeot's!) I don't know if it's sourced from Peugeot - or if it was done in house - but it's supposed to be a very good motor. The 5000 lb SUV it's in is supposed to be pretty quick. If this new motor has the same bellhousing pattern as the XD3 - I'll be importing one of these beasts for my 504 wagon. If the bellhousing doesn't match - then I may consider getting it anyway with the 5-sp tranny and just swap the hole unit in. If the 2.6 doesn't pan out or is too hard to source - then I'll look at the XD3 - but it's not turbo'd from what I can tell. (Might have to do source XD3 turbo upgrades here). One other option would be to source a Toyota diesel engine and tranny - the D4D is used there on some of their trucks and I heard that a couple 504's in Delhi had been retrofitted with the engine and tranny and it made for a FANTASTIC car. Trouble is that the Toyota's are in HIGH demand for the same reason - retrofitting existing trucks. Sadly there was no other Peugeot cross over I could find. Rabin (Time to start on my 505 wheel upgrade!)

http://www.bankspower.com/Tech_dieselperf.cfm For all the diesel fans - sounds pretty promising! After sampling that 90 Jetta GLi with the hopped up TDi I'd have to agree. That car would spin the front tires in 3rd gear when the car hit full boost! It would SMOKE the 505 Turbo in any acceleration contest - it wasn't even close. Too bad it sounded as loud as a tractor in the car or I could have bought it. The noise and the rough ride was too much for my wife to forgive as a "family" ar - but I was in love with that power train. It even had a Bora 6-sp in it. It was that car that got me thinking of seeing if the TDi injection system could somehow be retrofitted to the Pug diesels. I don't have any experience with the motors though - but the guys on the Peugeot-L list said it wasn't feasible... Too bad - a 2.5L Pug TDi hybrid with a big turbo would make for a very fast car.... Rabin

The only thing I don't like about the stock head is how shielded the spark plug is. Danielson found a way around it - but I still don't know how it was changed to get the 10mm spark plug in there. (I took a look to see if I could get mine changed like V-M did - but I had no idea how!) I'm thinking that if I can do a custom piston (Volvo?) and get some more displacement and compression I can afford to open up the combustion chamber a bit to expose the spark plug a bit more. Even indexing the plug would help a bit. (Making sure the electrode is open to the chamber - if the regular plugs are being used.) I may pony up for a Danielson head eventually (if mine cracks) - but It'd be a lot cheaper if I could pull a V-M and just have mine changed... I'm definitely curious on the flow characteristics - might have to get the head flow tested right after I get back from my trip... Rabin

I totally agree that losing the AFM isn't the holy grail of power production - but to me it's definitely one of the areas for improvement. The simple fact that the air path has a door that is pushed aside for the air to flow tells me that it's not necessarily the most ideal flow path. The size alone likely doesn't affect peak power production - it's just the way it measures the airflow. Spring loaded doors just seem to be the wrong way to do it. But it's a moot point if your just want a well running stock 505 Turbo - getting the car dialed in like Joe is famous for is going to net fantastic gains. I think the stock motor and set up (with tweaks) is going to easily hit the 250+HP mark. For me however - I'm pretty serious of my goal to get 300+ HP from this motor - and I want it to still be dead reliable. Since guys are getting this kind of power out of little Honda's, and Turbo Dodge guys are getting this out of their engines - I'm thinking it's entirely possible with the Peugeot. To me - In my mind - this has to be done with a more sophisticated engine management set up. I could be wrong - but I really want to try it and see for myself...

Hey Koll - Good to have you join the forum... I'm surprised it took you so long! Rabin

After shipping and exchange I'd be looking at $800 CDN for those - and that's just not worth it. I KNOW I can build them for less and they'll look just as pretty from the outside. (And still be well made) Depending on how easy they are to make, and if we can take molds from what we make, then it might be able to make them on a cost recovery basis. If it can't be done for max $200 USD for a set (without lights) - then I'll likely just play around and do up a set for myself. Ideally being able to do up housings for $100 USD would make it ideal and you might even be able to sell a couple sets. Rabin

Yep - I just checked them out and they are a 30mm drop. Works out to $365 CDN for a set - plus shipping of course. Not a bad price all things considered - I may have to e-mail them to see what the spring rates are - if it works it would save a heck of a lot of work. But doing a custom coil over is just cooler, so I'll probably do that and match them to Benz springs in the back. Is there any year in particular for the 190 springs? (There are virtually no european cars in Saskatchewan - so it's even weirder for me to be a Peugeot junkie. Sadly this also means no wrecks to pilfer parts from.) Rabin

Yep - What V-M said. I found the Canadian distributor but they've never returned any e-mails. I've heard they're over $800 for a pair though with lights - nothing concrete though. I love the look - but for that money I'd go for biode euro lights. I'm thinking of getting my buddy who's a fibreglass god to turn some ordinary US spec lights into that style. Make a stepped backing plate for the headlight buckets to mount to - then do up the headlight surround. If molds were done - it could be reproduced fairly easily - but again, tons of work with no return on investment. I've also seen them on South American cars - getting them sourced from there would be awesome - but Eduardo (From Peugeot-L) already said he couldn't locate anything when I asked him.... If you find something - let me know! I'd love a set for my car as well. Rabin