My 505s

[sideways]

Hi guys.

I'm new here, been lurking for years, just thought I'd show off my 505s.

This is my good car, its an October 1985 GTi, it's a manual with the leaded ZDJL engine, series 2 of course.

I've got a 1957 403 too .

Im in Australia, hence the right hand drive, lights ect.

Thanks

Hayden

[sideways]

This is my spare parts car, it's a August 1985 SR with a ZDJL and BA7/5 swapped into it. Its got a few mods, pod filter, a hot dog where the centre muffler should be and it's been lowered. Unfortunately it's mixing oil and water and has a blown fuel pump, metric wheels too .

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

Welcome to the forums Hayden.

Nice cars... I particularly like the Peugeot lion on the dash as well.

Does either car have a sunroof?

Any mods planned for the "good" car?

Rabin

[norcal505]

Welcome hayden! one of my best friend's named haydn too, funny calling someone else that. That's a great looking pair of cars. Can you please give us some more shots of the black car? Like a lot more. Looks really interesting. I love the rims, and what are the suspension specs?

[sideways]

Welcome to the forums Hayden.

Nice cars... I particularly like the Peugeot lion on the dash as well.

Does either car have a sunroof?

Any mods planned for the "good" car?

Rabin

Thanks

Niether of them have sunroofs, I've never seen a 505 in Australia with one.

For the good car I plan to rebuild the engine(it's done over 500'000kms now, it's a bit worn out), get a mild cam grind(there's a place in Australia that does different cam grinds for the ZDJ engine), a decent ecu, I'l get rid of the centre muffler too. There's a lot of smaller things that need fixing on it first (like its stupid electrics). Most of my time is going into restoring the 403 too.

And yeah, the Peugeot lion is pretty cool

Thanks

Hayden

[sideways]

Welcome hayden! one of my best friend's named haydn too, funny calling someone else that. That's a great looking pair of cars. Can you please give us some more shots of the black car? Like a lot more. Looks really interesting. I love the rims, and what are the suspension specs?

Hahaha I have a friend called Hayden too, gets a bit confusing at times .

Here's some more pics of the SRi.

It is a very nice looking 505, would of looked a lot better if the last owner had of taken care of it .

The wheels are wider than usual metrics, they've been painted a darker color and have new centre caps, they've got a bit of dish, I love 'em! They've got 16" tires on them now that seem to fit really well, I'm not sure if the rims have been modified to take them though.

From what I've seen of the suspension (very little, coz it's so low) it doesn't look like the springs have been cut, when I swap the wheels over I'l get back to you on that.

I all ways had a though of putting a rotary or something in that car.

I'l post some more later today, gtg now.

Thanks

Hayden

[sideways]

The thing with the SRi (the parts car) is that I think it's been rear ended at some stage, the floor in the boot is a little buckled, you can see the bog lifting of on the boot, the boots been resprayed at some stage too. The whole car also has quite a bit of rust starting just about everywhere. I'd love to fix it up but it's pretty bad and I've got other projects to go on with right now. Makes a great parts car though . I'd like to strip it out, put a different engine in it and go racing . Maybe when the 403's finished.

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

Wow - Those rims are definitely peaking my interest!

They have to be modified in order to have that bit of dish and to fit 16" rubber. If I knew what the recipe was for making those - I'd do that in a second with my metric TRX rims I have. I've checked into it here, and they can't machine the rim down to 15" as they figure it would then weaken the bead too much. (390mm = 15.35"). In order to make them 16" rims you'd have to machine the center section out, then weld them into another 16" rim.

Any chance you can take some real detailed pictures when you take them off? I'd love to see close ups of the lip, where the spokes meet the lip, and from the back side as well. I'm also curious to hear how wide they made them.

Better yet would be to find out who made those wheels so the details of how they were made, so they could be reproduced.

Rabin

[sideways]

Wow - Those rims are definitely peaking my interest!

They have to be modified in order to have that bit of dish and to fit 16" rubber. If I knew what the recipe was for making those - I'd do that in a second with my metric TRX rims I have. I've checked into it here, and they can't machine the rim down to 15" as they figure it would then weaken the bead too much. (390mm = 15.35"). In order to make them 16" rims you'd have to machine the center section out, then weld them into another 16" rim.

Any chance you can take some real detailed pictures when you take them off? I'd love to see close ups of the lip, where the spokes meet the lip, and from the back side as well. I'm also curious to hear how wide they made them.

Better yet would be to find out who made those wheels so the details of how they were made, so they could be reproduced.

Rabin

They interested me quite a bit too! They were one of the reasons why I bought the car! I think they're actually factory. Where it says the size of the rim it says "150 tr 390" instead of "135 tr 390" and that's cast in, not stamped. The last number is 20 instead of 30 on the normal metrics or 25 on the imperials so a different off set too? I'm dying to crack the bead on one and see if it's still got the silly TRX bead pattern! I'l get some pictures later when I get the camera back.

I have know idea who had the car when the rims were done, I bought it off an old guy who didn't take care of it at all, he didn't know who the previous owner was, there's certainly a few things I'd like to talk to them about! They really spent some money on this car....

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

If 16" tires are mounted then they are definitely modified...

604's were supposed to have a wider TRX wheel than the later 505 TRX wheels - but that's just something I've heard and not verified - so if that's true that could account for the sizing difference. There's no way a 16" tire would fit and hold air on an unmodified 390mm metric rim.

I had read on Aussiefrogs that there was someone who had a set of modified metric TRX wheels that were modified into 16" wheels, but I had never read of any details - just that it had been done.

Details would be awesome as I'm curious if the wheel center was fit into another rim, or if 16" wheel beads were welded onto the machined metric rim... That info should be apparent once the rims are off and the tire removed. Hopefully there are signs of what was done...

If it is a 16" wheel now - some pretty nice machining / modification took place because they look fantastic.

Rabin

[norcal505]

wow, those look great. I love the finish, and they most definitely look wider than mine, wider lip for sure.

[sideways]

Okay guys, here's some pictures. I'l take them off when it stops raining (it's winter here) and get some pictures of the back.

The whole rim.

The dish.

Dish on a normal 390mm rim.

Numbers.

More stuff.

I'd like to strip one down any see if there's any machining of welding marks there, there's one with pretty bad paint so I might get that one sandblasted when I do my imperials (they really need repainting).

Thanks

Hayden

[sideways]

Oh and Bean, I know there used to be a guy some where in Australia that turned 390mm rims down to 15", never heard of someone modifying them for 16"s though. I'l do some searches on Aussie frogs.

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

All will be revealed when you dismount one of the tires, and when you can check out the back side of the rim.

Either 16"wheel lips / beads were machined and welded onto these rims, or the center of the TRX rim was machined out and welded into another rim.

I've seen this done with other rare metric wheels, but it's quite rare.

I'm also guessing your wheel is now a good 7" wide with that much dish over stock. A VERY nice upgrade indeed. Finding someone to do that in Canada is pretty much impossible, so unless you have the skills and equipment to do it yourself it's likely not going to happen.

Rabin

[norcal505]

All will be revealed when you dismount one of the tires, and when you can check out the back side of the rim.

Either 16"wheel lips / beads were machined and welded onto these rims, or the center of the TRX rim was machined out and welded into another rim.

I've seen this done with other rare metric wheels, but it's quite rare.

I'm also guessing your wheel is now a good 7" wide with that much dish over stock. A VERY nice upgrade indeed. Finding someone to do that in Canada is pretty much impossible, so unless you have the skills and equipment to do it yourself it's likely not going to happen.

Rabin

It can be done in the land of opportunity, but for a great cost.

Maybe next week after the car's out of the body shop, I'll stop by memory fab, and ask them what they can do.

[sideways]

I think I've found who did it!

Have a look at this, they're just the same!

And here's how they did it, lucky for you guys, it's Skyline rims!

Here's a quote of what they've done.

OK, here is something really radical, which I do not recommend that people try at home. But it works, if done professionally.

My father used to have a mag wheel repair business, and he invented a solution for the TRX million-dollar-tyre problem as follows.

Purchase a set of Nissan Skyline 16" alloys with good second-hand tyres fitted. These wheels are common and cheap (around $250-$300 a set, with tyres) because the importers bring them in on cars and the buyers generally want 17" or 18" wheels fitted.

Remove the tyres and set aside for later.

Take the wheels to a machine shop and have them machine out the centres so that all you have left is alloy cylinders. My local engineer charged me a total of $80 for this.

Take your 390mm TRX alloys and cut the back off them, right behind the front rim edge. We've used a tungsten-tipped blade on an angle-grinder for this. You put your wheel on a Pug hub (on the car is fine) and rotate it slowly with a wheel-spanner on one of the wheel nuts as a second person cuts with the grinder. These blades are nasty pieces of work, so take extreme care using them. Alternatively you could have the machine shop do this cutting also.

Take your TRX remnants to the machine shop and have them turned down on the outside so that they fit neatly into the back of the Nissan rims. Note that there is a chamfered step in the Nissan rims, near the rear edge, and the TRX rim centres need to sit against it. Remember to check your off-set also, but the chamfered section on the Nissan alloys is a good guide.

When you have this done you need to get hold of some J-bolts and bolt the sets together, so that they run true. This is best done on a lathe also, but can be done on a Pug hub.

When the sets are made up and bolted securely, take them to an alluminium welder and have them seam-welded together front and rear.

Return them to the machinist for finishing the fronts (cleaning up the welds). Afterwards you can paint or polish. If your welder is any good both options will be fine.

Many factory alloys are bolted or welded two or three piece affairs, and the welded ones are never seam-welded right 'round, so I can't see a strength issue with this modification. But it does rest squarely on the quality of the tradesmanship. Which is why I repeat, I do not recommend this for people to do at home. But it is an idea for those who have access to the right tradesmen.

I know of three sets of these wheels and they are fine - and they look terrific - the outer rims are way wider than the originals and 16 inches of alloy is substantially more than 390mm. Also, the wheels themselves are wider, allowing you to fit 215/55/16s to your car. Driving a lowered 505 with 215/55s on is quite an experience. If you think the Michelins were good (and they were!), these will blow you away. Tyre technology has moved on in the last twenty years.

Regards,

John Lane.

Certainly cheaper than a new set of TRX tires!

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

Great find Hayden. That pretty much answered my questions quite nicely - so thanks very much!

I wish the pic links in that thread that showed the build, and likely which Skyline rim that was used; were still around. I tried the links with no luck... I'll be curious to see what I can find for Skyline rims - JDM imports are fairly common here, with Skyline's being a favorite with the drift kids. Like the say as well - stock 16" wheels can't be too $$$. If I can locate a set, and talk my buddy that owns a wheel repair shop - it might be worth a shot. I have a few TRX rims so it's worth a shot.

Biggest barrier is convincing a shop to do the work as they often refuse to even consider it because of the liability involved. Me being good friends with the owner and he's often refused to play with the TRX rims to see what we could do... Having specifics *might* help him change his mind.

BTW Hayden: The poster seems to have described your parts car quite well in the second last post. Blue, lowered, and running the 16" wheels.... You should PM him to see if that car he refers to is your parts car. Maybe he can elaborate on any other goodies it has...

Rabin

[sideways]

Great find Hayden. That pretty much answered my questions quite nicely - so thanks very much!

I wish the pic links in that thread that showed the build, and likely which Skyline rim that was used; were still around. I tried the links with no luck... I'll be curious to see what I can find for Skyline rims - JDM imports are fairly common here, with Skyline's being a favorite with the drift kids. Like the say as well - stock 16" wheels can't be too $$$. If I can locate a set, and talk my buddy that owns a wheel repair shop - it might be worth a shot. I have a few TRX rims so it's worth a shot.

Biggest barrier is convincing a shop to do the work as they often refuse to even consider it because of the liability involved. Me being good friends with the owner and he's often refused to play with the TRX rims to see what we could do... Having specifics *might* help him change his mind.

BTW Hayden: The poster seems to have described your parts car quite well in the second last post. Blue, lowered, and running the 16" wheels.... You should PM him to see if that car he refers to is your parts car. Maybe he can elaborate on any other goodies it has...

Rabin

I've Pm'd that guy a few times today, he said my parts car used to be his dads car . He gave me his dads phone number so I'l call him tomorrow, is there anything you'd like me to ask him? I'l be asking him what kind of Skyline the rims are off for sure!

I'm happy to post any pictures you need to convince your buddy to make the rims too.

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

I've Pm'd that guy a few times today, he said my parts car used to be his dads car . He gave me his dads phone number so I'l call him tomorrow, is there anything you'd like me to ask him? I'l be asking him what kind of Skyline the rims are off for sure!

I'm happy to post any pictures you need to convince your buddy to make the rims too.

Thanks

Hayden

If there's any chance either of them has the old wheel build pictures of how the wheels went together that would be perfect. I'm not holding out much hope for that - but if they can pin point the wheel used that would also help.

The more I think about it the more I'm not sure it really matters too much what 16" wheel is used. I'm guessing that if I can find the right set of 16x7 rims they could likely serve the same purpose. Knowing and obtaining the right Skyline rims would be the best - but it shouldn't be too hard to find another set of wheels that would work. Just copy the recipe and it should be fine.

So the important bit might be to find out WHY they used the Skyline wheel...

Also - can you get clarification on this bit:

"When you have this done you need to get hold of some J-bolts and bolt the sets together, so that they run true. This is best done on a lathe also, but can be done on a Pug hub. When the sets are made up and bolted securely, take them to an alluminium welder and have them seam-welded together front and rear."

Specifically what are "J" bolts, and how exactly are they used to bolt the two pieces securely together. I have an idea of course - but would like to be absolutely sure. Another question would be to ask if the fit of the two pieces should be a slight interference fit at all. (Freeze one, heat the other and they should slip together nice and then snug up on cooling is one method to get them together nice)

Pick a part wrecking yards are likely full of factory 16" rims, so that might be the cheapest way to do this experiment. The genius of this recipe is that they use the inside lip of the donor wheels for the outside lip of the modified wheel. I'm guessing that once the donor wheel is chocked up into the lathe with the inside of the rim in the chuck, then machine out the center of the wheel easily. Once you have the desired depth and the diameter to match the TRX center section it should just slip right in.

I'll have to convince him to make the attempt in the first place though. If he's up for machining the wheel parts separate, then I can have them welded, stress relieved, then back to him for machining.

As for pictures, I likely just need pics from the back side of the 16" wheel to show how it was welded in. Hopefully the weld bead is still visible. I'm also curious to see what the inside lip and the inside of the rim looks like (where the center was machined out of the donor).

Rabin

[sideways]

If there's any chance either of them has the old wheel build pictures of how the wheels went together that would be perfect. I'm not holding out much hope for that - but if they can pin point the wheel used that would also help.

The more I think about it the more I'm not sure it really matters too much what 16" wheel is used. I'm guessing that if I can find the right set of 16x7 rims they could likely serve the same purpose. Knowing and obtaining the right Skyline rims would be the best - but it shouldn't be too hard to find another set of wheels that would work. Just copy the recipe and it should be fine.

So the important bit might be to find out WHY they used the Skyline wheel...

Also - can you get clarification on this bit:

"When you have this done you need to get hold of some J-bolts and bolt the sets together, so that they run true. This is best done on a lathe also, but can be done on a Pug hub. When the sets are made up and bolted securely, take them to an alluminium welder and have them seam-welded together front and rear."

Specifically what are "J" bolts, and how exactly are they used to bolt the two pieces securely together. I have an idea of course - but would like to be absolutely sure. Another question would be to ask if the fit of the two pieces should be a slight interference fit at all. (Freeze one, heat the other and they should slip together nice and then snug up on cooling is one method to get them together nice)

Pick a part wrecking yards are likely full of factory 16" rims, so that might be the cheapest way to do this experiment. The genius of this recipe is that they use the inside lip of the donor wheels for the outside lip of the modified wheel. I'm guessing that once the donor wheel is chocked up into the lathe with the inside of the rim in the chuck, then machine out the center of the wheel easily. Once you have the desired depth and the diameter to match the TRX center section it should just slip right in.

I'll have to convince him to make the attempt in the first place though. If he's up for machining the wheel parts separate, then I can have them welded, stress relieved, then back to him for machining.

As for pictures, I likely just need pics from the back side of the 16" wheel to show how it was welded in. Hopefully the weld bead is still visible. I'm also curious to see what the inside lip and the inside of the rim looks like (where the center was machined out of the donor).

Rabin

Okay, I'l let you know how it goes.

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

Just saw the valve stem...

Since the Skyline wheel is "facing" in, the valve is on the inside of the rim. The TRX valve location is unfilled...

Some ideas to change this: you could weld up the stock Skyline valve stem hole, then drill a hole in the rim between the TRX valve location and the donor rim, and insert the valve in the TRX valve location.

One other "mod" to consider would be to machine out the web inside the holes to open up the pattern a bit. Increase cooling, shed some weight, and it shouldn't affect strength much since there will be quite a cross section of material with the TRX rim and the donor rim together at the same point. That ruins the idea of using the TRX valve location, but drilling a new valve location should be easy. (I'd balance the rims once all welded up, then add the valve where it needs the most weight to balance out...)

Yeah - I over think this stuff a litte too much...

Rabin

[sideways]

Hi guys.

Sorry for not updating this, my internet and phone were out for a few weeks (I live in the country so it's not that uncommon) and I completely forgot about this! Really sorry guys! I never got around to calling the previous owner of that SRi, unfortunately I lost his number when Aussie frogs crashed.

Anyway... Updates.

The good 505... uhhh well mum reversed out of the driveway and didn't close the door properly, the door swung open an caught on the gate, bending it around. That resulted in this. (sorry for the huge pictures)

http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=11365&d=1293713278

And she bent the hinges too so the door doesn't close, it doesn't really open either because the way she bent the guard against the door.

http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=11364&d=1293713278

That happened on the 30th of December, I still haven't gotten the parts to fix it, they're at a depot in Perth now (400kms away), I'm hopefully getting those this weekend. I still have to take it to the panel beaters which is about 100kms away (I live in the middle of nowhere). Gotta love having her out of action for so long :/

Anyway, here's she is in all her glory at the 2010 French car festival (In October), with the 16" rims on her.

Something pretty cool, mum bought that white 505 in the pic just recently. It's a 1982 automatic SRDT.

I am going to rebuild the engine in the GTi with some nice bits and turbo it. I'm aiming for 200HP at the wheels, I'l certainly need a better gearbox for that though! I've got a BA7/5 atm. BA10/5s are really rare here in aus, I don't think any cars were sold with them (we never got the V6 or the turbo).

For those who want to see, this is my 1957 403, otherwise known as Ruby. Her engine has been in several peices for more than a year now, she blew a head gasket on the way back from the show where this picture was taken. I can't find anyone to machine the head, they keep on making silly excuses not to.

Why can't I show pictures I've attached on Aussie Frogs??

Thanks

Hayden

[Bean]

Thanks for the update Hayden...

As for the links to AF - when you link a picture the link has to be to the actual .jpg file that's hosted on another site. Since your link is a page that has the picture - only the link to it shows up.

Rabin