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Posted

Got a bit of a longer one for ya :) Dont worry I know you like pictures so I put some in.

Oh boy I got another 505 Turbo. This one is a 1986 with the 4 speed auto.. or was at least. This car actually came from the same guy I bought my blue 89 turbo from. It was stored at a different location so I didnt know about it until he messaged me a few weeks ago. At first I wasn't interested but then he told me it was FREE so I knew I had to get it for parts at least. After 75$ for gas and a rental tow dolly I had what I thought was a rusted out seized engine parts car... but man was I wrong. Once I get it home I had a proper look underneath and to my surprise it had only a bit of surface rust under the trunk. And some other meaningless rust in the front corners. To me any low rust frame/shell is a car worth fixing, so I'm fixing this thing up. Also its the first one I'v seen with a blue dash, which is super refreshing I just love the blue interior.

It last ran over 20 years ago but thats pretty much standard for me at this point. I did a couple things before I tried to turn it over. I took the plugs out and dropped some old oil in the cylinders. I Checked the oil it looked like someone just replaced it. No coolant in the radiator which was suspicious at first.

I turned the key and it was turning over. I hooked a compression gauge up soon after and it was running on 70-80 psi across all four...

At this point it was time to reassemble the missing parts and diagnose it to try and start it. The spark plugs were lose, and there werent any plug wires and the intake up to the manifold was removed. I used a boroscope in the spark plug hole to see if it had rusted badly, but it was just full of spider webs haha. Better spider webs than rust I guess.

Things took an interesting turn here...   I tried to start it with some gas dumped into the intake before installing all the missing intake pieces, and I must of had the timing 180 off because it blew out a big ass dirt daubers nest.... Yep there was a big ol nest inside the intake manifold itself. So off that came and I put on another one that I cleaned up nicely. And after installing the intake and flipping the ignition 180 it was firing right up :)

The previous owner mentioned it sat because he bought it from another guy who was trying to fix it (Peugeot Pete was who he called it lol). Pete couldnt get it to idle right and neither could the owner before me. Well I knowing this car inside out found the issue, the auxiliary air device/cold idle valve was stuck and wouldnt open when cold. After tossing a spare on and letting it run for a few minutes it was running great. Now its turn key and starts right away and idles right.

Of course I needed to keep an eye on the cooling system, the pipe under the manifold was removed and other various hoses too, but I have plenty of spares and getting it sorted was no issue. The coolant level seems steady now, no coolant in the oil either. The tachometer, oil and coolant temp gauge all work (how in the world is that possible????)  Everythings looking good so far.

NOW ONTO THE FUN STUFF 😋

I have enough automatic turbos. So I'v already removed the manual drivetrain from the other 86 GL turbo as well as removed the automatic drivetrain from the new car. Its actually a simple and not to bad process. There is a bit of wiring to do in order to bypass the neutral safety switch but if you have a manual parts car you just plug in the manual harness and your good to do. For the clutch pedal you either have to drill a hole in the pedal box or swap one in. Those bolts are always a pain so I havnt decided what im doing yet. The only real roadblock in the manual swap has been getting the STUPID pilot race in the crankshaft for the torque converter out. It just wont budge. got any brilliant tricks? I'v tried bread, pry bar, torch, pilot pullers... I think im going to have to cut it somehow. I plan to fit this thing with a danielson spec cam at some point, since the other danielson powered car just isnt performing right hehe. Not sure where I can get another but I will

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Posted

Love all the pictures!

I’ve always had good luck with heavy grease in the pilot bearing hole, and then used a tight fitting socket, with extension in through the hex so the end is flat.  A very hard first hit with a hammer and it usually pushes the bearing out.  It sometimes take refilling with grease a few times, but usually works.

Rabin

 

 

  • 2 weeks later...
Posted

Well I ended up having to cit a slot in the bearing and then chisel it inwards until it basically fell out. It was very messy but finally got it out after hourrrrs of hammering. Went ahead and started putting everything together, Flywheel -> Torque tube is in and the rear sub frame is dropped back in place. Waiting for some differential mounts and seals to arrive before I put that in. In the meantime I have been cleaning up the pedal assembly. I decided to swap in a manual one instead of drilling a hole, it was very rusty so I sanded and resprayed... I used my balcony to hang it from to paint lol. Car will be ready for a test drive before I know it.

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Posted

Hey what do you guys use for a good performance tire these days? Stuff like Bridgestone Potenzas and Michelin Pilots are discontinued in this size unfortunately...

  • 7 months later...
Posted

Well I meant to post about the finished product for the longest time but never got around to it. The manual swap went super well, some wiring from a manual car was needed to allow the reverse lights and starter to work, but I had that available and so it was all plug and play. I welded in my own exhaust (no cat or muffler). As usual with these cars it took a few days of driving to figure out the electrical running issues (Ignition coil, relay connectors etc). After that I was driving the car for a month without any major issue until a Deer attacked the windshield. It took me weeks to find one, which I had to drive 12 hours to get. Now I am fixing a couple leaks it had, the transmission output and diff input seals. You can see in one of the photos the torque tube is just full of gear oil.

I gotta say this car has easily become my favorite to drive. Its the most comfortable and the most fun. My only complaint is second gear requires some force to get in.

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Posted

Very nice install on the windshield Jayden!  Looks great - Curious how you sourced it?

Great progress on the manual swap as well.  

For your trans not shifting - I’ve had great luck using Redline 75W90NS gear oil.  The no slip additive really helps tired synchros work better.

Rabin

Posted
1 hour ago, Bean said:

Very nice install on the windshield Jayden!

Haha, dont give me credit, I had a company do that part lmao. I got it from autoglass.net for both cars. One was 300$ the other was 160$

 

1 hour ago, Bean said:

or your trans not shifting - I’ve had great luck using Redline 75W90NS gear oil.

Heard similar from other folks, so I will give it a try once I know this transmission has stopped leaking

Posted

I tried the site and it was $428usd installed for the closest city in the US, or $268 for just windshield.  Good to know if I can’t source one in Canada.

And I meant going through the effort & expense of a new windshield.  I personally love a new windshield, and the flush install looks great - so kudos to the installer.

Is the motor stock on this car?  Have you played with any of the Danielson parts?

Rabin

 

Posted

Yeah the engine still remains stock. I think im going to skip the traditional danielson cam and go for something more aggressive. That is if I do a cam at all, because I very much like the how this car is now. I think the group B cam is what I was looking at

Posted

Do you have specs for the group B cam?

I didn’t even think of finding specs for that motor.

Rabin

Posted
19 hours ago, Bean said:

Do you have specs for the group B cam?

So I had actually misspoken, as I believe its more closer to gr.A cam. But its been modified, tweaked and developed by a guy who messes with Murenas. And he asked me sadly to not reveal cam specs, but just know it has alot more lift and duration than stock. So yeah its a NA cam not a turbo cam, which maybe will make it not work well. Im not a big expert on camshaft, yet

Posted

I’ve chatted with Youri as well - he’s done a LOT of work with camshaft design for his purposes, but a cam set up for high RPM NA race motor won’t be a great cam for turbo development.

I’m no cam expert either, but I do know NA race cams push the overlap way more than a Turbo motor would like.

There’s an awful lot of good info to be had, and even the cam grinding shops will likely have the best advice especially since these are low compression stock bottom end engines for the most part.

Rabin

Posted

Great info in the BX 4TC homologation papers, but I wasn’t completely sure it was documenting cam specs as there was no English to confirm.  

My thought was to collect what info I could to provide to the cam grinder and then ask for feedback.

The 4TC motor aside from being slightly destroked looked like it used the stock head design.  Was also curious if the document had actually specified the intake port lengths?

Rabin

Posted

Wasnt the 4TC 16 valve? it not twin cam?

Also thats funny you knew it was Youri, yeah its him. The cam in question isnt supposed to be for super high rpms (maybe 7,000 but stock rpms still use it well), at least from what Youri told me. Yes it has insane amounts of overlap compared to stock and danielson cams.

Posted

The only way to race in Gr.B with a 16v head was to build 200 street cars with it and Citroën didn't have the money for that.

It was in the older Gr.2 that you could just add it to the homologation papers, like BMW with the 24v head on the 3.0 CSL.

The stock 4TC is simply bored at 0.3mm under, even the special pistons are likely just machined out of regular blanks. That is again the cheapest way to do things, they probably didn't care about the Danielson head because for the race car they could do a lot of work on the regular head, cast a similar looking one or make a Evo head the next year as long as it was still 8v and single cam.

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