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1987 505 Turbo Revival


MGR550

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Another big weekend of progress! 

Fixed my speedometer; issue was that the drive cable is in 2 pieces, joined by a little plastic box below the brake booster that has some digital speed sensing going on. The box-to-dash side of the drive cable had shifted too far out from the dash side, so that was an easy fix.

Got new tires on it too finally; As with the old ones they are a super close fit from sidewall to the struts in the front.

New rear brake pads, oil change, removed the broken power steering pump, bled the brakes, and re-did the TPS-timing-idle speed setting. 

Found the high beam switch wasnt working so I took it apart, springs and tiny plastic bits went flying everywhere lol, I got it back together again but the part of the high beam switch that failed initially fell apart again, so ordered a new one which should be here soon from Latvia. Fog lights are now working too, which was just a bad bulb. 

Sunroof motor makes noise but doesnt move anything so I'm guessing a guide rail or gear broke. Headliner is starting to fall in a few places anyways so I think I'll pull it down fix the sunroof. I also found the AC doesn't work so in a black car the sunroof is going to be vital lol. Might pull the AC comp and condenser out since theyre just taking up space. 

New ECU is still quite happy, only issue is that the tachometer barely responds, slow to register changes... must be the new ecu but not sure what specifically would cause that. 

Also when doing the brakes I noticed that above the diff theres a little brake cylinder(?) that is acted on by a lever attached to the antiroll bar which seems odd.. ie if rear suspension is fully loaded down, itll apply the rear brakes

Once that light switch comes in and I find a windshield, I'll be driving it full time I hope!

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Sunroof cable sheath splits which causes the non-op.  Should be a guide on the site that should help.

It’s a brake compensator attached to the roll bar, the more weight in the car the more rear brake bias - it doesn’t apply brake, just allows more brake if that makes sense.

What size / brand / model tires did you go with?

Tach signal is off coil I thought, so might want to check connections there.

AC - I used to be quite unsure about AC and would always hire it out.  After abysmal work/service after a condenser replacement that would only last a season and that eventually took out my compressor when an print blew because of a crappy install.  I tackled the fix myself, replaced compressor, condenser and an AC line.  Has a buddy evacuate and charge with 134a last summer, just tried it yesterday after a LONG winter and it blew cold. 
 

As long as all the parts are there I’d say fix the AC - I won’t ever be afraid to tackle any AC system.

Rabin

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Drove the 505 to work today as my usual daily is full of parts and it was too wet for the bike, ran great and am super pleased with how it drives! I think I need to add a couple degrees more timing advance to make it really happy.

Lazy tach seems to have worked itself out, so likely just a loose connection. Ok sunroof will be a bit more of a project then it seems, not too bad though. Clever idea the designer had with the brake proportioning valve. Tires are a michelin 205/60-15,  which are very close to the struts in the front (maybe 5mm gap) but don't seem to be rubbing at all.

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Tires will never flex at the top, so guys have fit 215/60-15’s that just barely take the paint off with no issues.

I usually run 205/60-15 on my turbo sedans that I would auto cross with, and 195/65-15’s on other cars. 

Careful with the timing- I tried bumping timing on my cars, but anything more than 10degrees caused it to buck / cut out on my cars.  Best running I found was stock timing or just barely over, TPS adjustment bang on, and new vacuum lines for boost control.

Rabin

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Well after a full week of commuting and it was pretty great the whole time! love how the turbo spools early and just keeps going. 

Started noticing at med-low rpms the afr will dance around a little and jump a bit lean cyclically. Usually around 14.6-ish but will jump to 15 seemingly on a certain cylinder, so might need to get new injectors if there's a weak one. Also still need to replace the fuel pressure reg; Jayden's most recent post reminded me of that with the bit of a hard start I had in the cold this morning. 

Also still seems a bit reluctant to rev past 4000, maybe a combo of a weak injector, old pressure reg, and retarded spark, but afr at 3k+ on boost is around 10.5-11.5 area which I'd expect. Maybe its just me because it sounds a bit spooky revving that high. Maybe a nicer flowing exhaust might help 😋 

Still more fiddling to do as always but damn it feels good to finally drive it without much worry! I'll post some more photos once I get the popplar tree sap off it

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These cars really get under your skin for how they drive. The steering is telepathic and the road feel is absolutely one of the best I’ve ever experienced. 
 

They’re also great fun driving at the limit which is why I loved rallycross and autocrossing them.

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Not sure if this should be a new thread because it would have the exact same title, but I bought another Peugeot!! Another 1987 505 Turbo S! Near identical to my main one, but this one is silver colour, automatic trans, has ABS, and has 47k original miles. I had bought it intending it for a parts car for my black one just to get it to 100%, but its much too clean to pull apart. I haven't dug into it too much yet, but it seems like it won't need much to be drivable. This one sat since 1996 I think so it'll probably be much the same repair process as before. I'll post pics once I have time to start working on it. 

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And so it begins!  Start a new thread and just add “Part Deux!”  :)

Sounds like you got a very sweet car with really low miles!  Take lots of pics and know that you’ve graduated to expert level of Peugeot aficionado now that you’re a multiple Peugeot owner.  It’s inevitable when they really get to you - next thing you know you have 4 of them…. 
 

BTW - Can you post details of the place you got your ECU from?  
 

Rabin

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Ok will start a new thread shortly once I get some pics of it, lots of paperwork with it too including the original window sticker! 

I got the ECU from epartsland.com, based out of Pennsylvania it seems. 

Also, my shift knob makes quite the rattle/buzz at highway speeds which is very annoying. Is there a good way to stop the rattle? I'm worried to try and pull it off. My first 505 was missing the rubber piece and this one has a broken one in the glovebox so they seem fragile. 

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The shifter has some bushings in the shift assembly, and it connects to the trans with shift rods on “ball and socket connections.  Vibration is usually worn out sockets on the rods which are then metal on metal, or the shift bushings in the assembly itself which results in a sloppy shifter.

When in good condition there are few cars with as good a shifter feel - not quite Miata good, but still one of the best.  With some effort a DIY short shift and a weighted rod make it even better.

Rabin

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This past weekend I received 'rebuilt' injectors, but 2 or 3 were DoA so had to undo that which was a bit annoying.

Was swapping a few bits between cars and I noticed on my black one the distributor body is 90* clockwise compared to the other one. Obviously the plug wires and firing order are correct because its running, but is the hall pickup on the distributor used for position too or it is purely for engine speed? If it uses position to control injector firing then I might be triggering the injectors at the wrong time?

Matt

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Distributor body can be in whatever position in convenient, it’s rotor position at TDC that’s important.

And yeah - batch fired injection so no worries there.  It’s a decent injection system for the time, but very antiquated.  These engines should benefit greatly from a modern standalone ecu…

Rabin

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Mechanical injection is an incredibly elegant engineering masterpiece imo -  For me it’s similar to admiring a really nice analogue time piece.  Sure technology does it better, but the appreciation of that mechanical sophistication makes it better somehow!

 

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Ooo yeah nothing beats a clean mechanical injection setup. Also on the standalone ecu front, I ordered a speeduino V3 board a few moths back just to tinker with and see what theyre all about; might work nicely on a N9TE and supports sequential injection and a bunch of other fun stuff. 

On another front, I did a good full throttle pull yesterday and now it sounds like I have a small boost leak behind the dash somewhere. Nothing major because it still pulls decent and does build boost, but I can definitely feel it and the hissing noise is pretty obvious. Any good spots to check first? I suspect the hvac buttons because they sound pneumatic. 

Also, my local kenny-u-pull has an '84 505 in stock with a good windshield, which was the main reason I bought the silver car intending the glass to go to the black one, so im going to head there after work a grab some bits.

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The ‘84 will have bronze tint, your ‘87 should have green tint.  Moulding should be the same, but the plastic “T” strip holding the rubber moulding will shatter when you remove it.  Talk to your windshield guy to see if they can glue in a universal moulding, but it usually means gluing the windshield in a little higher off the flange for the moulding to sit nice.

HVAC is vacuum controlled, but you might want to check the o-rings in the hard lines connecting the turbo to intercooler.  

Speeduino sounds cool - I looked at MS, had a VEMS, and then ended up with an AEM Infinity 508 and an SDS 4F EFI stand-alone just via deals I came across.  Just need the time and space to make them happen!
 

Rabin

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I grabbed the windshield, taillights, and a few other bits from the junkyard car. Got the windshield out with just a box cutter blade to get through the urethane sealant. Should be getting the windshield swapped next week I hope.

Rabin you were right about the hard pipe o-rings being the source of the intake leak. One of the bolts holding the turbo up pipe to the intercooler had backed out and let the o-ring pop out a bit. 

On the more worrying side, on startup this morning there was some white smoke out the tailpipe when warming up. It smoked more than lightly but not heavily for about 30 sec to a minute. Didnt get a good chance to sniff it or anything, but I think I caught a whiff of the sweet smell we all know and hate. Still drove fine and everything and didnt smoke when warmed up at all. Coolant level doesn't seem any lower, but I didnt get the chance to check for coolant pressurization. Worried there might be a tiny crack that seals up when warm. It was rainy the last time I drove it about 4 days ago, really hoping it was just some extra condensation and the smell was just my nose fooling me.

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Windshields are usually done in butyl so they’re easy to cut out, if it was urethane then it can still get done but usually takes hours!

Bubbles in the coolant bottle is the tell tale sign when the motor is revved up. You’ll also start filling the coolant bottle up as it gets worse.

Still not a death sentence IMO - the right alloy head specialist should be able to fix them up since so many cars from the era crack heads.

Rabin

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I let the car rest for a few days then drove it, and again rest for a few days then drive and it hasn't smoked again like it did the first time since. On startup I'll get the usual tiny bit that you would from any car and it doesn't smell sweet. Maybe I'm just being overly hopeful lol. When it did smoke it was a bit of a chilly morning so if there is a crack its probably still small enough that thermal expansion closes it up, so hoping it'll hold up until fall.

Either way I found a few contacts who are volvo guys so may be able to do these kinds of repairs. I'll wait for it to get more noticeable before I really do anything about it..

In the meantime it's still driving great lol. Once I get the windshield swapped in I'll give the paint a proper clean and get it looking nice. Also I had a few wheel nuts break, in that the threaded part inside the washer chunked off in bits, so I ordered some ball seat washer/adapters and some new acorn nuts.

Matt

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The tell tail sign is bubbles in the coolant when the head cracks, smoking out the tailpipe is something else as the crack leaks combustion pressure into cooling system, never coolant until the HG fails completely from an over heat due to coolant getting pushed out.

It can go quite a long time on the cusp of pressurizing cooling system - and it can get stay usable a long time with proper cool down and warm ups (never beat on it cold!).

Rabin

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  • 2 weeks later...

Quick update: It does seem to be consuming coolant very very slowly (maybe 100mL in a month and ~300km of driving), but otherwise runs fine so I'm not too worried about it for now. Always do a proper warmup and cooldown, hoping I can stretch it until I get my other car running which may be a while yet.

Also finally finished up a few other projects so the lion gets prime real-estate in the driveway now; makes it so much easier to work on

Got the windshield pulled out and beneath was some rust holes from the cracked glass being there so long.  Honestly not as bad as I though given how the paint was bubbling around it. I think I can get away with just tack welds to reseal it instead of cutting and making patch panels. Original plan was to get it wrapped anyways to cover the scratched up paint. 

PSA to remove the plastic cover for the wiper mechanism and check that the drainage holes aren't filled up with leaves and stuff. Mine was just about fully plugged on both sides!

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What are steps are you going to do now?

I need to do the same to mine, and was thinking cut and replace as well, but will depend how strong the metal is under.

Por-15 with a top coat might be good - I was fairly impressed with how well the battery tray for my 505 TD turned out - it was quite rusted and the metal was pretty thin, but a couple coats of Por-15 made it quite good.

 

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